Curse

Reverend Dr · Jun 04, 2011, 07:55 AM // 07:55

I post a logically absurd statement.

People agree with me.

What the everloving RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO?

Quote:

Originally Posted by lemming

Just gonna link this post again.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...57&postcount=1

Quote:

Originally Posted by lemming

Simply put, you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

With the current state of powercreep a new player is such a huge liability. One player that doesn't gel with a team is enough to turn a great team into a terrible team. It was not always this way. If you want to blame someone blame Anet as every update is making mistakes less forgiving, which in turn makes less experienced players even less desirable.

The other assumption people keep making is that any attempt to "help" or "reach out" must be about grabbing PuG's from ID1. Despite this at best being terribly ineffective and at worst a complete waste of everyone's time.

Del · Jun 04, 2011, 09:39 AM // 09:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

I post a logically absurd statement.

People agree with me.

What the everloving RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO?

I'm surprised that that sort of stupidity surprises you here.

kedde · Jun 04, 2011, 10:01 AM // 10:01

Obvious sarcasm by reverend didn't get spotted. Good lord.

Brian the Gladiator · Jun 04, 2011, 11:56 AM // 11:56

The problem with HA is that all the old HA kids left HA to go GvG because now GvG is just flag pushing a.k.a. the same thing they did on relic running. I'm not joking... it's the same damn thing. GvG used to be way more strategic and pretty good HA guilds used to lose to mid-range GvG guilds. That doesn't happen anymore. Why is HA dead? because GvG is HA... with exception to cake split... which is probably why [WHAT] a.k.a. [Cake] is the best guild in GW and their monks got buildwarzed during the last MAT or they would have won that too. [WHAT] splits on any hall against any team and wins... why? Because they require teams to do more than just flag push.

End of discussion. If you want to HA, just GvG because that's what everybody else is doing, as far as PvP is concerned. In retrospect, PvE is what everybody else is doing though... so... yeah...

By the way, I'm a rank 5 hero (just never HA unless coerced by others) and I have played with rank 12-15 players quite a few times in HA (when GvG hours are dead) and the reason why they ask me to play with them, even though I don't know what the hell I'm doing, is because I listen to the experienced people and at least put forth effort to correct my mistakes. I know for a fact that if you understand that people who have about x100 the experience you have tell you something, they are probably right. If you don't understand why they are right, do it anyways and ask them after the match is over and they will explain it to you. It's not a hard concept... really. If you find it hard to find groups, you aren't looking hard enough. Go to QQ and join a gvg guild. Get to know some people and don't be an idiot.

Our Virus · Jun 04, 2011, 12:30 PM // 12:30

^knows exacty what he's talking about. Thread should now be closed

Reverend Dr · Jun 04, 2011, 02:29 PM // 14:29

What is really pissing me off is that simply because I am "high rank" that means that clearly I am not reaching out to anyone. This past month my guild has gotten 4 new people their bambi.

So please tell me how I am a horrible person because you demand to be reached out to, but refuse to do anything on your part to find and accept help from those willing to reach out to you.

Master Ketsu · Jun 04, 2011, 03:30 PM // 15:30

This would be a great idea if we could go back in time and implement it back during the days of prophecies when pugs where still alive and people actually cared.

These days:

Quote:

The problem with HA is that all the old HA kids left HA to go GvG because now GvG is just flag pushing a.k.a. the same thing they did on relic running. I'm not joking... it's the same damn thing. GvG used to be way more strategic and pretty good HA guilds used to lose to mid-range GvG guilds. That doesn't happen anymore. Why is HA dead? because GvG is HA... with exception to cake split... which is probably why [WHAT] a.k.a. [Cake] is the best guild in GW and their monks got buildwarzed during the last MAT or they would have won that too. [WHAT] splits on any hall against any team and wins... why? Because they require teams to do more than just flag push.

End of discussion. If you want to HA, just GvG because that's what everybody else is doing, as far as PvP is concerned. In retrospect, PvE is what everybody else is doing though... so... yeah...

By the way, I'm a rank 5 hero (just never HA unless coerced by others) and I have played with rank 12-15 players quite a few times in HA (when GvG hours are dead) and the reason why they ask me to play with them, even though I don't know what the hell I'm doing, is because I listen to the experienced people and at least put forth effort to correct my mistakes. I know for a fact that if you understand that people who have about x100 the experience you have tell you something, they are probably right. If you don't understand why they are right, do it anyways and ask them after the match is over and they will explain it to you. It's not a hard concept... really. If you find it hard to find groups, you aren't looking hard enough. Go to QQ and join a gvg guild. Get to know some people and don't be an idiot.

Is pretty much correct. The HA community is a tight nit community and many of the players in that community play for sport, not rank. Contrary to what many PVE players believe, HA is not about rank. HA is about politics. Network, join a pvp guild, actually be good at the game, and you will find yourself being let into said tight nit community. Rank is used as a "guesstimate" of how good a random pugster nobody has heard of may be, and nothing else. If people have heard of you and know how you play then no one cares about your rank. I've gotten into r12 groups back when I was only r4 through connections and the people knowing how I play. No one ever asked me for my rank when I was in those groups. No one actually gives a shit.

Daesu · Jun 04, 2011, 03:42 PM // 15:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

What is really pissing me off is that simply because I am "high rank" that means that clearly I am not reaching out to anyone. This past month my guild has gotten 4 new people their bambi.

So please tell me how I am a horrible person because you demand to be reached out to, but refuse to do anything on your part to find and accept help from those willing to reach out to you.

Obviously my message got across, and I have already said that high ranking people who wants to continue to exploit this, by ensuring easy victory against new comers, may not like this suggestion so I already expected this response from high ranking players. This is why many new comers shun and would continue to shun HA.

Also don't play the "I am the poor victim" role, don't make this about you personally.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

Is pretty much correct. The HA community is a tight nit community and many of the players in that community play for sport, not rank. Contrary to what many PVE players believe, HA is not about rank.

Not about rank?

This is typical screenshot of HA. Look at the r9+, r10+, and r7+ invites, what are those?

Master Ketsu · Jun 04, 2011, 05:10 PM // 17:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

Not about rank?

This is typical screenshot of HA. Look at the r9+, r10+, and r7+ invites, what are those?

You obviously didn't read the second half of my post.

Daesu · Jun 04, 2011, 06:34 PM // 18:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

You obviously didn't read the second half of my post.

Your point of getting into groups based on reputation alone just doesn't apply to new comers.

Master Ketsu · Jun 04, 2011, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Read Brains post again. The HA community is dead. That reputation comes from GvG now.

I'm not saying rank scaling is a bad idea. It just comes too late. The HA community is controlled by the GvG community. Those teams you see there just want a good player. You think the people in those teams actually are all R7 and R10+ Etc? No. Those teams are probably all Guilds and alliances like 99% of all non randomway teams are these days. They just want a player to add that isn't a failcow, extra rank for having a low ranked person just isn't worth it.

That being said I wouldn't mind seeing rank scaling just for the fun of it to see what happens to HA. Just as long as it starts at 100% and scales upwards from there otherwise some people might rage. It's already dead, what's the worst that could happen? lulz.

Bright Star Shine · Jun 04, 2011, 07:55 PM // 19:55

This entire suggestion is like saying "let's force DoASC guilds to take DwG noobs with them, because it's unfair they can do it faster and better than them". I.e. pretty fcking stupid.

Forcing players to play with others isn't gonna help anyone.

Kanyatta · Jun 04, 2011, 08:29 PM // 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

So how does it work when there are only 5 teams in HA? How could this possibly make anything better?

This.

Whenever I've HA'd within the past few weeks/months, it's always been fight the Zaishen, clock resets 4 times and I finally get a match in the first map. 90% of the time the opposing team is Henchway. Win. Wait for another 4-5 clock resets, Halls skip.

No one is playing Heroes Ascent anymore, except for r11+ guilds who hold halls, r0-3 henchway pugs, and the occasional bored GvG guild.

Your suggestion would probably convince nearly everyone who is r9+ to finally quit the game, since you'd be taking away their in-game rewards. HA would have as much activity as the Codex Arena, and PvP would take one giant leap backwards into obscurity.

/notsign

cantalus · Jun 04, 2011, 08:37 PM // 20:37

the presumption of entitlement is awesome, get some backbone and earn your place in HA, be nice, make friends, use observe for christ sake

and don't presume pps don't take new people sometimes, the active pvp community that gives a damn about posting on guru is small, what is said here isn't definitive

as for how dead HA is, well, there are many many reasons why, but mostly i'd say anet's ineptitude with nerf/updates and their utterly strange favouring of lame assed eB sz FAT cc MATH etc shitways, since most of my friends just got bored with that shit and left to play SC and LoL

Daesu · Jun 04, 2011, 11:48 PM // 23:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

Read Brains post again. The HA community is dead. That reputation comes from GvG now.

I'm not saying rank scaling is a bad idea. It just comes too late. The HA community is controlled by the GvG community. Those teams you see there just want a good player. You think the people in those teams actually are all R7 and R10+ Etc? No. Those teams are probably all Guilds and alliances like 99% of all non randomway teams are these days. They just want a player to add that isn't a failcow, extra rank for having a low ranked person just isn't worth it.

That being said I wouldn't mind seeing rank scaling just for the fun of it to see what happens to HA. Just as long as it starts at 100% and scales upwards from there otherwise some people might rage. It's already dead, what's the worst that could happen? lulz.

I think it needs a change to jump start it, at least worth a try. The first thing that turns off a rankless person interested in HA is that you can LFG for 30+minutes and still not get into a team.

I joined those teams that asked for rank and they are really serious about the rank because they wanted proof before entering a game and they wont negotiate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanyatta

Your suggestion would probably convince nearly everyone who is r9+ to finally quit the game, since you'd be taking away their in-game rewards. HA would have as much activity as the Codex Arena, and PvP would take one giant leap backwards into obscurity.

If ANet implement it in a way that the rewards still stay the same if they win, only difference is that the low ranked team would get MORE rewards if they win against a high ranked team.

Reverend Dr · Jun 04, 2011, 11:50 PM // 23:50

Quote:

Also don't play the "I am the poor victim" role, don't make this about you personally.

What is that psychological defense where you apply your faults to others?

Daesu. Everything you have been saying is about PuGing in ID1.

No one that knows what they are doing in HA joins those groups. The people that know what they are doing form from guild/alliance/friendlist.

Aside from that those groups in the photo are doing you a favor by not letting you in. You don't want to be in those groups. I have I high enough rank that I could get into those groups. I do not. Well unless I have an odd fancy to watch a trainwreck unfold.

I truly wish those groups in your picture would have taken you. I really and truly do. Then just maybe you can get it through your head that complaining about bad PuGs wanting rank requirements then trying to generalize to the rest of the HA players is piss poor reasoning.

Get it out of your head that PuGing is the only way into HA. Join a PvP guild. Don't act like a spoiled brat. Don't act entitled. Listen to what they say. Try to get better. And voila you suddenly have HA groups.

People will reach out if you let them and are willing to reach back. Standing in ID1 is not how you do that.

Daesu · Jun 04, 2011, 11:54 PM // 23:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

I truly wish those groups in your picture would have taken you. I really and truly do. Then just maybe you can get it through your head that complaining about bad PuGs wanting rank requirements then trying to generalize to the rest of the HA players is piss poor reasoning.

Get it out of your head that PuGing is the only way into HA. Join a PvP guild. Don't act like a spoiled brat. Don't act entitled. Listen to what they say. Try to get better. And voila you suddenly have HA groups.

I understand what you are saying but step into the shoes of a rankless PvEer for a moment. They enter HA to join a team and what do they see? They can't get into a team with someone who knows what they are doing. How can they avoid feeling frustrated and quit?

Why are there not enough teams? You guess maybe the fact that it is that tough for a new comer to participate is a big reason for it?

Bright Star Shine · Jun 04, 2011, 11:55 PM // 23:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

I understand what you are saying but step into the shoes of a rankless PvEer for a moment. They enter HA to join a team and what do they see? They can't get into a team with someone who knows what they are doing. How can they avoid feeling frustrated and quit?

Join a guild.

/thread

Daesu · Jun 05, 2011, 12:00 AM // 00:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine

Join a guild.

/thread

That may work for a select few but definitely cant be the solution for everyone. They have friends in their current guild. They wont know if the pvp guild would work for them and they may still want to PvE with their guildies from time to time.

Bright Star Shine · Jun 05, 2011, 12:03 AM // 00:03

If you really want to get into HA/GvG you should be naive enough to stay in your PvE guild. You'll make friends in the other guild as well. And hey, maybe if you grow tired of the PvP and go back to PvE, you'll be on someone's friendlist and you'll get pm's to join them to roll some noobs in HA... Me probably being one of those noobs, but anyhow..

If you don't want to put the effort in, you shouldn't get the reward. But nowadays, everyone is QQ'ing it's too hard to get them and want them handed... You give them a finger and they want your arm (actually, dunno if that's an expression in english, but it's one in my language, so)..